Author Topic: Thinking of having 1911 range gun built locally. Few questions. (Read 529 times)

YamaLink · « **on:** November 29, 2011, 08:55:18 AM »

A few cliches about "can't make chicken salad out of chicken shiyat" or "lipstick on a pig" are related to this question.

I was thinking of having a 5" 45acp 1911 built by a local trusted gunsmith. Purely a range gun, maybe do a little SSTK or CDP. Don't want anything crazy expensive but I know quality costs. Say the budget was anywhere from $1000 to $1500. This is purely a "want" and not a need to make me think it'll catapult my shooting accuracy to another level.

Do I give him the likes of a STI Spartan or Springfield Range Officer as a foundation or is it better to have the frame, slide, etc new from the ground up?

Is there a price point where I'd be better off with a Trojan from Dawson (about $1000) or a new Valor (about $1700) or a Springfield Match or buying a $650 Spartan and putting in a new bushing and doing the usual cleaning, respringing, sear tweaking.

luvmy45 · « **Reply #1 on:** November 29, 2011, 09:09:16 AM »

You build whatever you want, however you want, when it comes to a 1911, you really can't go wrong. That's beauty of it.

In short, there is no wrong answer, but a lot of right answers.

I had a chance on Sat to handle an original 1911, 4 digit serial number gun... wow, piece of history right there... I could feel gun wanting to bite my hand just handling it, but I still wanted it... he wasn't selling. What a piece of history.

Anyway, get a box of parts, and get yourself a 1911 built for some range fun... and btw, have it done by April.

junkie · « **Reply #2 on:** November 29, 2011, 09:16:34 AM »

Said gunsmith can get a frame slide kit from STI. If he is a quality smith he will have good ideas on parts to get to finish the build. This will keep you from buying a complete gun and throwing away parts.

Jaggy13 · « **Reply #3 on:** November 29, 2011, 10:01:33 AM »

Quote from: junkie on November 29, 2011, 09:16:34 AM

Said gunsmith can get a frame slide kit from STI. If he is a quality smith he will have good ideas on parts to get to finish the build. This will keep you from buying a complete gun and throwing away parts.

+1

dutch1911 · « **Reply #4 on:** November 29, 2011, 11:45:00 PM »

My opinion... But is be remiss if I didn't. There are no 1911 Gunsmiths locally (that I could recommend) that can build a top notch reliable depend your life on it 1911.

Dutch1911
1/*

junkie · « **Reply #5 on:** November 30, 2011, 11:53:18 AM »

Well Dutch I know you and I have to call BULLSHIT on this one. If you would like the name of said gunsmith we will take this to PM. It is of topic to the original post so I won't go into detail here.

luvmy45 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 30, 2011, 12:05:14 PM »

Quote from: dutch1911 on November 29, 2011, 11:45:00 PM

There are no 1911 Gunsmiths locally (that I could recommend) that can build a top notch reliable depend your life on it 1911.

Dutch,

Awe come on now... your making an argument that's not related to this post... he doesn't want a depend on your life 1911, he wants a range gun... which I would argue if it runs reliably at the range, it could be used to depend on for your life, but anyway...

There are a number of gunsmiths in the area that can and do do very good work on 1911's...

tgibson · « **Reply #7 on:** November 30, 2011, 08:38:22 PM »

Quote from: dutch1911 on November 29, 2011, 11:45:00 PM

My opinion... But is be remiss if I didn't. There are no 1911 Gunsmiths locally (that I could recommend) that can build a top notch reliable depend your life on it 1911.

Dutch1911
1/*

The one I had built locally has about 14,000 rounds through it (conservative guess...I've had it for two years), and I can count the number of non ammo related jams I've had with it on one hand. You can bet your ass I'd trust my life with it.
Adios,
TG

dutch1911 · « **Reply #8 on:** December 03, 2011, 11:50:17 AM »

Not to create an argument... But I've personally watched your weapon fail multiple times at every IDPA match I've seen you at.
If that's reliability to you... Then have at it. For me complete and total reliability cannot be compensated for by laying blame on ammunition.
Neither of my 1911's have ever failed in any way.... Proof is the pudding.
T not to discount hat you do in any way. This is strictly an opinion by me supported by countless hours of research. There are several good Smiths out there, but few that understand the timing issues associated with a 1911.
With that being said, I know there are smiths around I'm unfamiliar with. I should have rephrased my previous comment to read less abrasively. I'm unfamiliar with the work of a couple of local smiths. And I apologize for the manner in which I made the previous statement, it should have read, I cannot recommend a local smith as I'm unfamiliar with all and wouldn't recommend those I am.
Also, my mindset on the budget build is this. For the money you would be better off with a factory gun. Again... my opinion only. I've seen several budget builds and my experience as an Armorer... spend on reliability.
On the other hand budget is also a decision maker... But.. you get what you pay for. The only smith I would go to in Idaho... Clint Goss at Goss Guns.
And yes I understand the OP however he wants to get into some level of competition yes? Reliability is essential even to having a good time at the matches. I'm not trying to cause argument or hard feelings I would hope the OP open his options to a greater picture. For his money a Springfield A-1 loaded is an outstanding choice. The new Ruger is also a well made gun. To go custom with only a grand... And ill say it... Will likely lead to displeasure with the final product. No one... NO ONE enjoys shooting a gun that is unreliable.
If I've offended... I do apologize... I'm not always right but I do call it how I see it. And there is also the possibility that T had a gun built by a smith I'm unaware of.
Good luck with your endeavor I would encourage you to look at some better options for the money you have available. I hate to see anyone have reliability issues with a 1911.

Dutch1911
1/*
Black Talon Defensive Dynamics LLC.

dutch1911 · « **Reply #9 on:** December 03, 2011, 02:43:31 PM »

Junkie... Thanks for the schooling brotha!

I've said all I should say at this point... I'll bow out.

Dutch1911
1/*

Black Talon Defensive Dynamics LLC.
"Always Carry... Never Tell!"

tgibson · « **Reply #10 on:** December 03, 2011, 07:42:18 PM »

Quote from: dutch1911 on December 03, 2011, 11:50:17 AM

Not to create an argument... But I've personally watched your weapon fail multiple times at every IDPA match I've seen you at.
If that's reliability to you... Then have at it. For me complete and total reliability cannot be compensated for by laying blame on ammunition.
Neither of my 1911's have ever failed in any way.... Proof is the pudding.
T not to discount hat you do in any way. This is strictly an opinion by me supported by countless hours of research. There are several good Smiths out there, but few that understand the timing issues associated with a 1911.
With that being said, I know there are smiths around I'm unfamiliar with. I should have rephrased my previous comment to read less abrasively. I'm unfamiliar with the work of a couple of local smiths. And I apologize for the manner in which I made the previous statement, it should have read, I cannot recommend a local smith as I'm unfamiliar with all and wouldn't recommend those I am.
Also, my mindset on the budget build is this. For the money you would be better off with a factory gun. Again... my opinion only. I've seen several budget builds and my experience as an Armorer... spend on reliability.
On the other hand budget is also a decision maker... But.. you get what you pay for. The only smith I would go to in Idaho... Clint Goss at Goss Guns.
And yes I understand the OP however he wants to get into some level of competition yes? Reliability is essential even to having a good time at the matches. I'm not trying to cause argument or hard feelings I would hope the OP open his options to a greater picture. For his money a Springfield A-1 loaded is an outstanding choice. The new Ruger is also a well made gun. To go custom with only a grand... And ill say it... Will likely lead to displeasure with the final product. No one... NO ONE enjoys shooting a gun that is unreliable.
If I've offended... I do apologize... I'm not always right but I do call it how I see it. And there is also the possibility that T had a gun built by a smith I'm unaware of.
Good luck with your endeavor I would encourage you to look at some better options for the money you have available. I hate to see anyone have reliability issues with a 1911.

Dutch1911
1/*
Black Talon Defensive Dynamics LLC.

You must have me confused with someone else. If I had a POS gun that didn't run that I ONLY used for competition, do you think with all hundreds of hours I've invested in practice, the thousands of dollars I've spent in gear, the other two guns I use, and travel, I'd continue shooting that same POS?!?!?! REALLY!?!?! DUDE THINK ABOUT IT!!! I've sold/replaced $1300 shotguns because they had a 3% failure rate!!!

Then again, maybe you're right...maybe I should take some more classes and get a Glock. They're perfect aren't they?

Adios,
TG

J Mack · « **Reply #11 on:** December 04, 2011, 08:19:13 AM »

Quote from: dutch1911 on December 03, 2011, 11:50:17 AM

Not to create an argument... But I've personally watched your weapon fail multiple times at every IDPA match I've seen you at.
If that's reliability to you... Then have at it. For me complete and total reliability cannot be compensated for by laying blame on ammunition.
Neither of my 1911's have ever failed in any way.... Proof is the pudding.

Dutch1911
1/*
Black Talon Defensive Dynamics LLC.

Dutch,

Do you believe that a factory Colt 1911 will shoot as many trouble free rounds consecutively in a competition environment as Travis’s STI Franken gun? Do you believe that a factory Colt 1911 would really make a superior competition firearm over say a factory SVI? Is the measure of reliability any different in your world than Travis’s and don’t tell me that you are in a shootout for your life every day for tens of thousands of rounds. You base your reliability opinion off your pistols performance in practice just like Travis and I guarantee Travis shoots more rounds, the difference is Travis “is” in a shootout for his life on the weekends with tens of thousands of rounds and if his pistol fail’s he doesn’t necessarily lose his life but he does go home empty handed.

Please don’t take my comments as a personal attack they are just questions about your belief.

Jaggy13 · « **Reply #12 on:** December 04, 2011, 09:36:30 AM »

Quote from: dutch1911 on December 03, 2011, 11:50:17 AM

Neither of my 1911's have ever failed in any way.... Proof is the pudding.

That is probably one of the most ignorant statements I have ever heard.
To imply complete reliability out of any platform is just asinine.
Everything has a failure point, EVERYTHING!

If your pistols have never failed then you obviously have not shot them enough.
1911's especially have parts that wear and need to be replaced. How many rounds do you have on said pistols?

I have personally watch Travis burn down stage after stage after stage, match after match after match.
I want a pistol just like it and will have one someday.
To bring this back home for the OP, Travis's pistol is the perfect example of what I think you are looking for.
Just like Junkie originally posted, box of parts + local smith= top end shooter.

My comp 1911 has served me very well, I have about 10k rounds through her and usually only have clean it every 1-2k.
The USPSA state match was in Idaho falls this year, I barely made it the entire day without having to clean it just to finish the match that was about 200 rounds. The conditions were so hard on it, it was dusty and windy and my pistol was so dirty and gritty that had to use a brush on my mag well before every stage just to seat mags. When finished it was easily the dirtiest I have ever seen it.

dutch1911 · « **Reply #13 on:** December 04, 2011, 10:38:58 AM »

Oh jaggy jaggy jaggy....
Coming from a guy that rarely cleans his weapon... I'll leave your comment in the wind...
My 1911's are very well kept. Say what you may... I know what I've observed.
Enjoy

e11charlie · « **Reply #14 on:** December 04, 2011, 10:49:22 AM »

What does all of this matter? My penis is still the biggest and my dad would kick your dads ass.

luvmy45 · « **Reply #15 on:** December 04, 2011, 10:55:44 AM »

To all interested readers of this hijacked thread. I would present some pudding for you all to proof.

http://3gunnation.com/the_series/standings/s/overall_standings/

TG is 29 out of 1400 on that list, and said detractor is nowhere to be found.

You can believe who you want, myself... I kinda like the results of our local shooter.

And think he does just fine at local matches with a local gunsmith built box of parts.

dutch1911 · « **Reply #16 on:** December 04, 2011, 11:30:07 AM »

Anyway...
Another option for th O.P. is Fusion parts kit. For anywhere from 600-700 bills you can start your build off with a high quality frame and slide that's pre fitted and has a lot of great finishing touches already complete from the start.
Take a look its worth your time.
http://www.fusionfirearms.com/menu/1911_kits.htm#1911

jordonhurd · « **Reply #17 on:** December 04, 2011, 11:39:24 AM »

popsgunner · « **Reply #18 on:** December 04, 2011, 12:45:50 PM »

YamaLink · « **Reply #19 on:** December 04, 2011, 04:02:53 PM »

I'm going to "hijack" this thread and ask about a range-only 1911 being built by a local gunsmith.....

That Fusion parts kit is interesting and the intro price is nice. I'll have to do some reading.
Thanks.

Okay, back to the original hijacked thread.

Quote from: dutch1911 on December 04, 2011, 11:30:07 AM

Anyway...
Another option for th O.P. is Fusion parts kit. For anywhere from 600-700 bills you can start your build off with a high quality frame and slide that's pre fitted and has a lot of great finishing touches already complete from the start.
Take a look its worth your time.
http://www.fusionfirearms.com/menu/1911_kits.htm#1911

avking · « **Reply #20 on:** December 04, 2011, 04:09:45 PM »

Dean Barton is a really good local smith that can build you a nice range gun in your price range. Give him a call.

YamaLink · « **Reply #21 on:** December 04, 2011, 04:22:57 PM »

Thank you. I will do just that tomorrow.

Quote from: avking on December 04, 2011, 04:09:45 PM

Dean Barton is a really good local smith that can build you a nice range gun in your price range. Give him a call.