Author Topic: Barrel Profile (Read 561 times)

WhaleNoises · « **on:** November 10, 2011, 08:54:26 AM »

Now the next question I have in building my own AR-15 is the profile of the barrel. I'm trying to make it light without sacrificing durability. I worry that a light weight barrel is too light but a HBAR is way too heavy. anyone got any insight on mobility or durability of a gov't or m4 profile barrels. Is the HBAR not very heavy or will the light barrel stand up to 150 bullets fired as fast as I can?

Nealio · « **Reply #1 on:** November 10, 2011, 10:19:49 AM »

When you say 'way too heavy', what do you mean? Like you can't pick it up, or too heavy to shoulder fire for an extended period of time?
Do you own a couple Beta C-Mags? How are you going to be shooting 150 rounds as fast as you can, and why?

Nomad · « **Reply #2 on:** November 10, 2011, 10:24:14 AM »

Have a Colt light weight match barrel that has been through several Patrol Shoots of the earlier days
where we shot several hundred rounds and the forearm could not be touched with a bare hand.
Has made a couple of MGM and still shoots a sub group with a 69gr bullet.....
In the earlier years we had light weight barrels on the M-16 during the Vietnam conflict........
As with a any heavy barrel it does hold a better group what you want to carry is your choice....
Debate over any issue and you still have a choice as to what you may choose to use for your way of thinking....
16", 18" or 20" which is best for a three gun match...... Your choice ..........
Chevy or Ford.......Chicken or Egg.....We can go on and on.....

hessmanca · « **Reply #3 on:** November 10, 2011, 11:47:55 AM »

I have owned and run several barrel profiles. I loved the light weight for carrying, and under light use it was fine. I have used a pure HBAR which held up to abuse perfectly. To be honest the M4 or Government Profile really doesn't take away that much weight from that of a HBAR and you loose some of the benefits of having the true HBAR. So unless you have a M203 to slap on it or just like the look, not a lot gained by it.

Currently I run S/S medium contour barrels, primarily Noveske's. Weight is lighter than a true HBAR and way more durable than a light weight. I would also recommend running a Hammer Forged barrel. They are lighter than a standard Chrome Molly, hold up better to abuse and will last longer than a standard.

WhaleNoises · « **Reply #4 on:** November 10, 2011, 04:28:07 PM »

I will be using it for SHTF and home defense. its going to be a 16" mid length BCM 1:7 twist with all BCM upper parts, with DD lower. Normal trigger all mil spec parts. Back up Iron sights with either an EOTech or ACOG. If there is some kind on natural disaster I will be carrying it all the time hence wanting a light weight barrel. I also want it to withstand a beating, I will be getting the barrel hammer forged to add that extra insurance. I will most likely be using pmags and plan on having at least 5 of them so if I need to unload for whatever reason I want to feel that I don't need to worry that I will destroy my barrel, hence a heavier barrel. I'm thinking a happy medium would work like a gov't profile or m4. But I don't know a lot about barrels so maybe a light barrel is ok if its BHF or maybe a HBAR is not really that heavy. I just want to get all the info I can from you guys to help me make the decision.

ballardw · « **Reply #5 on:** November 10, 2011, 08:29:07 PM »

The original M16 barrels are what is no called a "light weight" profile. Lots of them were fired full auto way more than they should have been and didn't wear out.

JollyRoger · « **Reply #6 on:** November 10, 2011, 08:30:32 PM »

Gov't profile works just fine...plenty of folks who carry an M4 or M16 in addition to 50lbs of extra shit in 3rd world countries will tell you it works.

I like either government or medium contour barrels, no reason for HBAR unless you want to drive tacks at long distances (IMO).

WhaleNoises · « **Reply #7 on:** November 10, 2011, 08:44:46 PM »

ya this will be for run and gun stuff no long distance tack driving. If i can hit center mass at 300 yards I will be happy.

J Mack · « **Reply #8 on:** November 10, 2011, 10:19:29 PM »

Why is the heavy .223 barrel more durable than a light barrel?

JollyRoger · « **Reply #9 on:** November 10, 2011, 11:18:40 PM »

Quote from: J Mack on November 10, 2011, 10:19:29 PM

Why is the heavy .223 barrel more durable than a light barrel?

Because you can pry bigger rocks with of course!

Jaggy13 · « **Reply #10 on:** November 10, 2011, 11:42:05 PM »

Come to a 3 gun, see these things in action.
You can see everything from a 14" - 20" AR to a Bushmaster ACR.
Handle a few and see what the fuss is all about.

See what works and what doesn't really matter.

We have a great event coming up on new years day. Probably one of the best opportunities to see just about every build out there.

For what its worth, its been my experience that whatever you choose will be more accurate that you are capable of, budget for some ammo and practice session or even a class or 3.

birddog1989 · « **Reply #11 on:** November 11, 2011, 02:19:13 AM »

This might give you some ideas.

http://www.model1sales.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=375
http://www.model1sales.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=389
http://www.model1sales.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=374

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/16-Mid-Length-Barrel-s/38.htm

http://www.midwayusa.com/find?&sortby=1&itemsperpage=20&newcategorydimensionid=9637

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/cid=10901/k=/t=P/avs%7cMake_3=AR-15zz1zzM4/avs%7cCartridge_1=AKK_5xzzx56+mm+NATO%7cAJJ_223+Remington/Products/Rifle-Barrels

J Mack · « **Reply #12 on:** November 11, 2011, 07:20:10 AM »

Quote from: JollyRoger on November 10, 2011, 11:18:40 PM

Because you can pry bigger rocks with of course!

Will the hammer forging and chrome lining help also?

luvmy45 · « **Reply #13 on:** November 11, 2011, 07:56:51 AM »

Just BUY ONE and SHOOT IT!!!!

:sarcon:This thread is starting to remind me of the mall ninja cartoon video on which color is more tactical in a urban setting.

Seriously, I think your approaching your build way too seriously, you need to just build it and shoot it, figure out what works for you... and Jaggy gave the best advice, come out to a 3 gun and see what everyone is running, you've got tricked up and box stock all on the same rack waiting to be shot... and the biggest difference between all the guns is the shooter, not the gun.

As long as the gun goes bang, every time you pull the trigger, then you really haven't done anything wrong. And if it were me starting over from scratch... I'd be more concerned about the trigger than the barrel. Of all the things on my AR that I wish I would have done differently at the start... better trigger...

If you shoot enough to wear out a barrel... your either living in the wrong part of the world, or your shooting some serious 3 gun matches every weekend.

Not saying they don't wear out, but you have to do a lot of shooting to do it. It's not going to wear out sitting in the safe protecting the house.

WhaleNoises · « **Reply #14 on:** November 11, 2011, 08:23:47 AM »

Im very meticulous about my guns. The .22 I build suits my needs and wants, but there seams to be less choices when it comes to a .22 then an AR. With my .22 I built I can hit pennies at 200 yards, thats the longest range I've gone to shoot at. So there is not much else I can do to make it more accurate or better. I want the same for my AR, I will take time to build this gun. I will be going to any 3 gun match I can to see what everyone is using, but I probably wont be shooting 3 gun so all the advice I get thats leaning to whats best for 3 gun I take with a pinch of salt. My AR wont be shot as much as my .22, for cost reasons, unless it is needed for SHTF.

J Mack · « **Reply #15 on:** November 11, 2011, 08:40:21 AM »

In all seriousness No-One mention that he might try to put a fun shoot together and we could bring some rifles out for you to try.
Why don’t you PM him and see if you guys can get this going and we can get some AR’s for you to shoot and check out.

popsgunner · « **Reply #16 on:** November 11, 2011, 08:48:29 AM »

wait, wait whoa, whoa....hitting a penny at 200 yards....cmon a bit of embelishment here, meticulous maybe but lets be honest here. And .223 for home defense....seriously, do you live out in the country where the thru and thru penetration of that round won't effect your wife in the other room or neighbor in the house next door ?
Sorry but just like LUvmy45 says, just buy one and shoot it, light profile is good for casual shooting, heavy for almost all other, bull for taget, long range and bench events. Done, 1-8 twist for the heavy and bull seems to be the best, 1-9 in most barrels for the widest all around accuracy and shooting, most light bbls are 1-7 for the rest.
pops

luvmy45 · « **Reply #17 on:** November 11, 2011, 09:44:25 AM »

Don't come out to a 3 gun and look for competition model guns to compare to... Look for the "joe schmoe gun"

I have a box stock RRA 16" LAR-15, about the only thing I've done is replace the handgaurds and added a scope and new gas block that's low profile, and a BAD lever.

Nothing fancy, and perfect for Zombies, 3 gun, 2 gun, rifle comps, and general plinking... I want to upgrade some more stuff like the trigger and I would like an 18" for various reason related to competition, but most of the guys out there just shoot a normal AR of some variety.

It's one thing to fondle a gun in a store, come out to the range and not only can you fondle them, but you can shoot them and see how they work. We just did a scope range day, (I missed it) time for an AR range day!!!

WhaleNoises · « **Reply #18 on:** November 11, 2011, 09:58:47 AM »

Quote from: popsgunner on November 11, 2011, 08:48:29 AM

wait, wait whoa, whoa....hitting a penny at 200 yards....cmon a bit of embelishment here, meticulous maybe but lets be honest here.

I've done it twice with the gun in my sig. It's capable of doing that, I cant do it often but it has been done twice.

Jaggy13 · « **Reply #19 on:** November 11, 2011, 10:57:29 AM »

here's the deal...

You keep asking for attributes to 1 gun that does it all...
Light for HD and zombie appocolyps, accurate for pennies at 1000 yards and so on.

The reason I keep suggesting come watch a 3gun is because thats what we do with them.
We go from a room clear situation to running 100 yrds dropping prone and shooting targets out to 600 yrds.

what you don't get is that what you are describing as your goal in a rifle is what we build them for and we use the hell out of them.

The new years event will just be plate racks, but you'll have the oportunity to see every possible configuration oh and watch tthem be used.

WhaleNoises · « **Reply #20 on:** November 11, 2011, 11:24:11 AM »

Where and what time is the new years event?

popsgunner · « **Reply #21 on:** November 11, 2011, 01:19:57 PM »

Even a dead watch is right twice a day, a couple of lucky shots,, no my friend, CAPABLE means repeatable and on demand.
It is a lot of fun to try though, EVERYTHING is capable, very few are able. you'll find your gun.
Pops

birddog1989 · « **Reply #22 on:** November 11, 2011, 01:54:57 PM »

Quote from: Jaggy13 on November 11, 2011, 10:57:29 AM

You keep asking for attributes to 1 gun that does it all...
Light for HD and zombie appocolyps, accurate for pennies at 1000 yards and so on.

When did he say that? Someone else brought up the zombie shit and he was joking. I read back through his posts and all I saw was...

Quote from: WhaleNoises on November 10, 2011, 08:44:46 PM

ya this will be for run and gun stuff no long distance tack driving. If i can hit center mass at 300 yards I will be happy.

Maybe he meant something else. My bad.

WhaleNoises it seems like you pretty much know what you want,

Quote from: WhaleNoises on November 10, 2011, 08:54:26 AM

will the light barrel stand up to 150 bullets fired as fast as I can?

Any quality M-4 profile barrel will handle this with no problem. (and who really gives a shit why he wants "his" gun to do this. Maybe he is going to hang it from his ass off a tripod with a belt feed conversion so giant frogs won't fuck with him on Halloween cuz he dressed up as a fly

)

Quote from: WhaleNoises on November 10, 2011, 04:28:07 PM

a 16" mid length BCM 1:7 twist

The deciding factor will be, how much money do you want to spend? If you want to go cheap, under $200, the quality could be hit and miss. If the cost is no big deal or you can wait and save I would say go with something $400 and up you will be better off. With that being said price is not the only thing that you can judge by. If I had the choice between a $450 Noveske or a $650 DPMS, it will be the Noveske with out a doubt. Then again Daniel Defense is supposed to make a decent barrel for a decent price. Check out Midway and read the reviews on the barrels that catch your eye. I think you would be better off with a 5.56 chamber so you don't have to be concerned about feeding it .223 or 5.56. Any impact on serviceable accuracy will be nil especially with a higher quality barrel. After you figure out what barrel you want start looking at bolt and bolt carrier options. I would go for a Colt or LMT but even they can go T.U. on you anytime.

Just remember to take your time read up on as much as you can and end up spending your money on the rifle you want, not "some thing" someone told you to buy with out knowing or caring what you want.

carharttfarmer · « **Reply #23 on:** November 11, 2011, 02:22:46 PM »

dosent make much differnce really just pick the wieght you like best
i have/had 16-18-20 barrels from dpms ,delton,wilson and a noname all shot moa or better and cost 200 or less and were built into guns with nothing more than 2 blocks of wood a vice and $20 ar multi tool

fj40mojo · « **Reply #24 on:** November 11, 2011, 03:10:31 PM »

Quote from: birddog1989 on November 11, 2011, 01:54:57 PM

(and who really gives a shit why he wants "his" gun to do this. Maybe he is going to hang it from his ass off a tripod with a belt feed conversion so giant frogs won't fuck with him on Halloween cuz he dressed up as a fly )

That's exactly what I was looking for! How did you know I dressed up as a fly

luvmy45 · « **Reply #25 on:** November 11, 2011, 07:36:26 PM »

Quote from: WhaleNoises on November 11, 2011, 11:24:11 AM

Where and what time is the new years event?

Parma Rod and Gun Club
Start around 10am

There's a thread on it in the Shooting Sports area...

dutch1911 · « **Reply #26 on:** November 19, 2011, 08:28:22 PM »

The government profile is perfect. Unless you're building a 20" match barrel you won't gain any type of "benefits" from an HBar. The additional couple of pounds is simply not worth it. There will be no felt accuracy improvements from mounting an HBar on a shtf gun.
There are lots of good advice here... You really need to determine barrel length and twist. All that comes down to the bullet weight you intend to shoot. Again... Everyone has an opinion. Me personally... I like the military setups... Enjoy
Dutch1911