Western Idaho State Fair Gun Restrictions

[sheepdog1]

Mama Sheepdog here. So Sheepdog 1 and I went to opening day at the fair. Tried to get in and after they inspected my purse contents was informed that I could not take my gun into fair. Keep in mind I do have my concealed carry permit and my Pink Lady is always in my purse.No signs posted anywhere and not on tickets. Was told by Rent a Cop that even he was not allowed to carry, that the fair grounds are private property and no guns allowed.(We thought the fairgrounds was county property?) Was told to take my gun and put it my vehicle and would be allowed to enter. We have had the truck broken into so no way was I doing that.As I am standing there being informed I can't take my gun in Sheepdog 1 is standing there wearing his gun in a holster under his shirt. What a mess and a joke. As we are leaving I see them making a woman with an infant let them look in the diaper bag and baby stroller. Moral of story don't take you gun in inside a purse.Wear it!

[MarkinIdaho]

Since when are the fair grounds private property?  Did the county sell??  I don't think so!  Wasn't this settled some time ago?  County can't enact laws, rules, etc., superceding state law??  Private property, or at least businesses, for that matter, I believe have to have signs posted.  I think this is nothing but bull sh!t.

[9Shooter]

I remember this topic being discussed before.  I think in the end there is something in the contract that allows the event management/organizers to determine whether they will be allowed or not.  The property is not private as I recall.  Here's a thread from last time: http://www.boiseshooters.com/index.php/topic,1613.0.html

[carharttfarmer]

walk back to the parking lot stick gun in pocket come back go in then put it back in your purse if you like

or spend the time to look into the legality of it like others have before


 but badges ,clipboards and "staff "shirts bring out the rule nazi (asshole) in somepeople

[popsgunner]

they make the same rule for gun shows and announce it before the show opens......Thank god for Kel-tec and desantis.

[luvmy45]

Gentlemen, don't take this the wrong way, but don't be mad at the stupid, moronic gate attendents.

It's not their job to know the law, they get paid a measly amount of money to do what they are told... no amount of arguing, will convince them that you have the right to carry, because your right stands between them and a paycheck. They have been told what to do, and they are doing it.

We need to goto to the people that hire the guards... and bring in the sheriff department (which are on site all over the place down there)

This is a county event... not a private event like a gun show, the director of the fair is a county employee and that is county property, if it's our right, and we want to excersise it, then we have to goto the people that actually matter, and bring in the people that should know the law... the sherriff.

[fj40mojo]

So, if I am reading this correctly, by law you should be able to open carry or concealed carry if you have a permit. Seems to me this is an opportunity for the open carry group to picket and maybe get some attention from the media. At the very least, show up with state code in hand and make a stink. I always carry when I go to the gun shows, what they don't know doesn't hurt them and may ultimately save my life.

[popsgunner]

here we go....IMHO,
The law about open carry is not in question here, Idaho allows open carry, period, concealed carry with a permit, done. The fair maybe on county property, run by county employees, but gang, pick your battles and look and the common sense of the carry. +1 for FJ, what they don't know will not harm THEM, I agree. Open carry in a place where you are surrounded by a thousand screaming teens and mothers with babies and scumbags in droves looking for trouble, you are ASKING to have a conflict. I suppose if you are willing to spend the time, get the open, retentive style holster, pack the law with you....sounds like alot of bullshit, just carry concealed, very concealed, ankle, pocket, neck, so when the "highlypaid and educated" gate guards ask, you can open your purse, lift your shirt at the waistband, never giving a thought to it, they see nothing, your still armed and go and have some fun. Pick your battles.

[fj40mojo]

here we go....IMHO,
The law about open carry is not in question here, Idaho allows open carry, period, concealed carry with a permit, done. The fair maybe on county property, run by county employees, but gang, pick your battles and look and the common sense of the carry. +1 for FJ, what they don't know will not harm THEM, I agree. Open carry in a place where you are surrounded by a thousand screaming teens and mothers with babies and scumbags in droves looking for trouble, you are ASKING to have a conflict. I suppose if you are willing to spend the time, get the open, retentive style holster, pack the law with you....sounds like alot of bullshit, just carry concealed, very concealed, ankle, pocket, neck, so when the "highlypaid and educated" gate guards ask, you can open your purse, lift your shirt at the waistband, never giving a thought to it, they see nothing, your still armed and go and have some fun. Pick your battles.

I agree pops, open carry at the fair would not be appropriate, I was referring to this as a political opportunity for that group to get some media attention. IMHO open carry at any time gives up a tactical advantage and I don't do it. My point is that this seems to be a situation where the law is on our side, but after a little more thought I suppose it's not the best event to use as a political venue, more likely that the sheeple would think "why do you need a gun at the fair?" which would lead to legislation that would make it illegal. Better to just concealed carry deep and be prepared to defend yourself legally if you get caught or God forbid a situation arises and you are forced to use your weapon. On a side note, could you imagine a more target rich environment for an active shooter than the fair? Sheeple as far as the eye can see.

[Bill, Idaho]

This issue came up here a year ago about the Canyon county fair. Very basically speaking: at the CC fair, the carnival is contracted out, and the people that run the carnival say no guns (or whatever). Technically, the county isn't prohibiting the weapons, the carnival owner is.  I have no clue how it is done in Ada County at that event.  
Someone was once saying there is an obscure law that says TECHNICALLY, a person could walk into a courthouse as long as the gun is not concealed.


And personally, as far as the comment on "always carrying at a gun show...it may ultimately save my life..."
  At a gun show, I would wager wearing a level 2A vest would offer a far better chance of saving your life.  (Spoken partly in jest and party in truth.) Gun shows are by far ND magnets, not so much armed robbery.   I'm just sayin'.
  I went to a concert a few years ago outside at the Idaho Center in Nampa. At the gate they were looking through purses, etc.  A sign said something along the lines of no weapons. The security guy (NOT a real cop) asked me if I was carrying any weapons, to which I very quietly told him "yes, I am wearing a pistol, I am an off-duty police officer..." He steps back and gets that lost-in-the-middle-of-Times-Square-look. A real cop was standing right there kinda' paying attention. The security dude and the cop make eye contact. The cop nods and motions the dude to let me in (and then indiscreetly flips me off).
  Pops has it right on though, choose your battles.  This probably could be "won" (I like the term settled better) by going through the right channels and working out the problem.  A confrontational attempt to settle this would offer no one a chance of winning.  

[luvmy45]

I am not advocating a "let's draw attention to this", If I wanted to make the point that I am legal to bring in a concealed weapon, (since it's county property at a conuty event. The carnival is only one small section of the fair, I can't see how they could dictate how the other 75% of the fair is run.)

I would request the that the gate attendant please call Bob Batista to the gate in question, he is the fair director and county employee.

I would have the converstation with him, and him alone with the law in my pocket, assuming that it is. If that did not get me in, then I would request that Bob Batista please summon the sherrifs department, which is on site all over the place, to confirm that I am correct or not.

If I was on a crusade to get into the fair with a concealed weapon that they knew about... don't need media attention, wrong kind of publicty for the concealed weapon permit holder IMHO.

But... since I carry concealed in a way that 99.9% of the sheeple don't notice... it's not a crusade that I would take on. Just sayin... don't shoot the messenger at the gate, your just banging your head against a concrete block and it won't get you anywhere.

[popsgunner]

Thanks Bill, "settled is a better term.You are SOOOOO right about the gun show dynamic. BP vest would be better for the amou nt of ND's going on.
BK, I still don't think the effort you describe would worth the time and attention for the " Reward"
I have actually discussed this type of action and reaction WITH the open carry group, they are receptive but are in the developmental stages of their org, so all help we as full time 'Gunny's" can offer should be appreciated.
Keep it up gang. Y'all are the bomb.

[ballardw]

I'll have to check next time I'm down there but there have been signs on the parking lot fence with the prohibition posted that have been there long enough to sun fade. Of course if you come in the right way you won't see the signs as they faced the road near the entrances to the display buildings.

[MarkinIdaho]

Stumbled across this on another forum I hadn't visited in a couple of years....

http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?79202-Western-Idaho-Fair

[fj40mojo]

Stumbled across this on another forum I hadn't visited in a couple of years....

http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?79202-Western-Idaho-Fair

That was an interesting turn.

[Bill, Idaho]

Ok, someone make a copy of that and try going through Canyon County's courthouse entrance.
  The fair, that's one thing, but the courthouse.......I am going to guess they will not have a sense of humor about it.
And, I happen to know the Deputy that responded to the question.  He is the nicest guy around.

[Bill, Idaho]

Hmmm, if you google Idaho senate bill1441, it doesn't really pertain to the subject, exactly. Got a better senate bill number?

[WTF]

kinda relevant

Des Moines police are trying to determine what led to a series of attacks outside the Iowa State Fairgrounds over the weekend that included the assault of two police officers.

At least three people were arrested Friday through early Monday morning. Other arrests may occur as officers investigate the incidents, officials said.

There are indications that some of the fights - which appear to involve mostly teenagers and young adults - were racially motivated, police said.

We don't know if this was juveniles fighting or a group of kids singling out white citizens leaving the fairgrounds," Sgt. Lori Lavorato said. "It's all under investigation, but it's very possible it has racial overtones."

Officials announced last week that they were stepping up security outside the fairgrounds after a series of attacks Aug. 14 that included a pair of stabbings. Investigators are still investigating those assaults and victims intend to pursue charges.

Sgt. David Murillo stated in a report on Friday night, "On-duty officers at the fairgrounds advise there was a group of 30 to 40 individuals roaming the fairgrounds openly calling it 'beat whitey night.' "

Jammie Carroll, 36, of Polk City, was seriously injured in the 3000 block of East Grand Avenue Friday night after a group of people beat him up, causing severe injuries to his eyes, cheekbones and nose, Murillo wrote. Carroll is white, and many of the suspects are black, police said.

State Rep. Ako Abdul-Samad, D-Des Moines, who has worked to fight gang-related violence, said he doesn't have enough information to decide if the fights were racially motivated. He said police comments that race was involved could miss other factors, such as nonracial taunting.

"Unfortunately, like any other city, you have certain parts of town that individuals congregate in," Abdul-Samad said. "You have those that go into that area with no problem, and those who cannot."

He added, "We of course need to work on race relations. If anyone says we don't, they are playing games with themselves."

State Fair spokeswoman Lori Chappell said she had few details about the incidents. Police had increased security near the western edge of the fairgrounds specifically, she said.

The fair, which drew more than 960,000 visitors over 11 days, ended when the gates closed at 1 a.m. Monday.

About 10:30 p.m. Sunday, two police officers were attacked as they waded into a combative crowd outside the fairgrounds' main gates at East 30th Street and Grand Avenue.

Sgt. Richard Schuett and reserve Officer Lynn Hubbs both complained of head, neck and back pain after being punched from behind while trying to make arrests.

"There were pockets of people fighting," Schuett said. "People were leaving the fair and they were walking into the middle of them. We were trying to move people along but some of them wouldn't move."

A police report says Schuett "was on the ground fighting with his suspect, and several other females began to attack him." Another officer grabbed one of the attackers and tried to make an arrest, but she spun away.

Officers sprayed chemical deterrent and deployed a stun gun while trying to gain control. Two teenage girls were taken into custody for questioning following that incident.

Also Sunday night and early Monday:

- Beth Longen, 25, of Des Moines was at the gas pumps at the QuikTrip store, East 30th Street and University Avenue, taking video of the crowd when she was assaulted about 11:20 p.m., police said. A 17-year-old girl allegedly slapped Longen and threatened her in front of police officers. The teen was one of several taken to police headquarters and later released to parents.

- Earl Tice, 17, of Des Moines was attacked near East 30th Street and Grand Avenue about 9:45 p.m. Sunday. He told officers he was jumped while leaving the fair. Tice was having X-rays taken at a hospital when police took a report from his mother. Officials said he had been kicked and punched.

- Officers arrested Daveion Trell Smith, 18, of Des Moines on a charge of disorderly conduct. Police said they observed him with a large group of people, yelling and gesturing and trying to start a fight with another group of people. He was warned and told to leave the area, police said.

- Kiera Agee, 18, of Des Moines was charged with disorderly conduct. Police said they told her several times to leave the area. She allegedly responded by swearing at police. She was arrested and was taken to jail.

- Ashley Robinson, 18, of Des Moines was charged with interference with official acts. Police said they were doing paperwork in the parking lot of a fast-food restaurant near the fairgrounds when Robinson walked up demanding answers to questions. Police were holding several suspects there at the time. She was ordered to leave the area. When she refused, she was taken into custody.

Laurie Christensen, a resident of Walker Street near the fairgrounds, said she's never seen such hostility around the fairgrounds.

Groups "have been openly taunting the police - in the street right to their faces," she said. "We found some of them that ran from the police hiding in our backyard."

Register staff writer Perry Beeman contributed to this article.

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20100824/NEWS01/8240366/Police-say-it-s-very-possible-attacks-near-fairgrounds-had-racial-overtones

[agunforeachhand]

2 different subjects all together WTF on subject is on carry and another is about a bunch of menace's to society.


How is it relevant?

[RGinIdaho]

2 different subjects all together WTF on subject is on carry and another is about a bunch of menace's to society.


How is it relevant?

It points out one of the fallacies put forth by the OC crowd. Read the first sentence. The OC'ing police officers were attacked as opposed to deterred by the mere sight of a firearm...
 

[agunforeachhand]

 

[WTF]

How is it relevant?

it happened at the fairgrounds, where thugs like to show up, hence the common sense reasoning for people to carry firearms at family events.

[fj40mojo]

Relevance

Not saying that it would happen here in SW ID, but if a group of (race) decided that it was "beat whitey night" and I was singled out because I had the misfortune of attending said "family event"  on that particular night I'd feel totally justified in my decision to exercise my right to keep and bear arms. Family event or not, if I can't carry I'm not going and they won't be collecting any of my money. Don't kid yourself if you think there aren't ethnic groups in ID that may harbor ill will towards you. Whether or not they are willing to act on those feelings is the question and are you willing to take a chance and leave your firearm at home. This does not preclude the fact that there are even more folks out there that have bad intentions that are not racially motivated.

[Nomad]

 We have a choice as to our rights and the use of them, common sense would be one.
 Right to protect our families....

[junkie]

I saw 2 people OC there last night