Topic: Red dots for AR platform

[Bill, Idaho]

Do you have a Model T style crank start on your car?   

[agunforeachhand]

Do you have a Model T style crank start on your car?   

I am to young to understand what you are talking about? Could you being old enough explain this to me

[birddog1989]

What about a Trijicon Tri-power?

http://www.trijicon.com/user/parts/parts_new.cfm?categoryID=11

[luvmy45]

Define red dot...

1x red dot that you use for CQB type work? Low profile and easy to see around, thru with BUIS

1x - ??xxx red dot that you use for CQB to 500yds or so?

I use a Millet DMS-1, that is a 1x-4x scope with a red dot type reticle... usually set to 1x for CQB work that I can use with both eyes open, but has magnification for farther distances when requried... and a red dot for evening/night time use.

The scope is fully usuable even with dead batteries in the day time.

For me, the price and functionality of this type of scope works well. As my intended use changes I may have multiple optics or guns with different optics as needed/wanted

[broncovan]

It depends on what you mean by red dot.  For close quarter stuff, CQB, then actual red dots w/out any magnification are the way to go.  But since I don't do any CQB work, then I went with an ACOG TA31.  4 power magnification with ranging abilities.  No batteries required.  Top of the line optics, can't be beat when looking at magnified optics for a tactical application.

Aimpoint, very nice, but big and clunky.  Some models have a very long battery life.  Very rugged.

EOtechs are very nice also, nice low profile good battery life with proper model.  Not quite as rugged of construction.

ACOG, some have magnification, 0-4 fixed power, all are tritium powered, some have a fiber optic input for lighting.  The nice thing about the fiber optic models is that it gives you only the brightness that you need.  No intensity adjustments to make, always just the right amount of light so the chevron or doughnut doesn't wash out your scope.  Even at night with a few stars out, you get see a very faint red chevron, not enough to affect your night vision, but enough to see.  If it's the inside of cat black, you get a faint green glow from the tritium "battery".

IMO, ACOGs (I really, really like my TA31) are the way to go.

[Riverhouse]

For my purposes of a red dot.......1x magnification for CQB out to 200 yards at the most generally for this gun.  My other's have higher magnification scopes on them but this is the carbine with 1x red dot.

[Tomac]

I've used numerous Aimpoints, Eotechs & Trijicons over the years, all have their strengths & weaknesses.

The best KISS optic (IMHO) is the Trijicon RX30 w/no batteries, switches or adjustments to worry about (it uses tritium & fiber optics for reticle illumination) and a huge FOV through the 42mm objective. However, reticle washout is still possible under some lighting conditions.

I love the Eotech's circle/dot reticle, it seems faster for me than a simple dot. However, battery life is relatively poor, the control buttons aren't as fast/easy to use as the Aimpoint's rotary switch and they have more reported problems than Aimpoints.

Aimpoints win, hands-down, when it comes to ruggedness & insane battery life (50K-80Khrs of 24/7 use on a single battery) and w/the Aimpoint Micro you have a small optic that weighs less than half that of the other major contenders.

After completing my wife's lightweight STG build w/an Aimpoint Micro H-1 I decided that shaving nearly half a pound off my own rifles was a good thing! Got a great deal on the H-1's w/a halfway decent mount from Botach for $450: http://www.botachtactical.com/aih1pade.html
Tomac

Wife's lightweight STG w/Aimpoint Micro:

One of my STG's now w/Aimpoint Micro:

[Riverhouse]

With the Aimpoint H-1's, they come with a 4 MOA dot.  Is that too big?  Just right?  Some of their other models come with the 2 MOA.  From my understanding, 4 MOA is just fine with CQB but for longer ranges it starts to cover up the target therefore for pinpoint accuracy it is less desirable.  I don't think it will matter to me since most of my shooting will be within 100 yards.

[technique]

With the Aimpoint H-1's, they come with a 4 MOA dot.  Is that too big?  Just right?  Some of their other models come with the 2 MOA.  From my understanding, 4 MOA is just fine with CQB but for longer ranges it starts to cover up the target therefore for pinpoint accuracy it is less desirable.  I don't think it will matter to me since most of my shooting will be within 100 yards.

Just turning down the brightness settings helps with the longer ranges. I've gone out to 400yrds with a micro shooting a two legged critter sized targets.

[Riverhouse]

Just turning down the brightness settings helps with the longer ranges. I've gone out to 400yrds with a micro shooting a two legged critter sized targets.

That's good to know.  Thanks for the input. 

[luvmy45]

4 MOA is equal to 4" at 100 yards and 8" at 200 yards and so on,  you can do the math for 2 MOA dot. 

Depending on your target size, that will tell you if the 2 or 4 MOA dot is preferable... at close distance's it's not an issue, but if your shooting a ground squirrel at 100 yards... a 4 MOA dot may cover them up, and at farther distance's, shooting small targets precisely is harder to do.

Zombies out to 200 to 300 is no problem with a 4 MOA 

[RGinIdaho]

I luv's my 2moa. My load is 2moa high at 100, on at 200 and 2moa low at 300. You do the math!

[Tomac]

With the Aimpoint H-1's, they come with a 4 MOA dot.  Is that too big?  Just right?  Some of their other models come with the 2 MOA.  From my understanding, 4 MOA is just fine with CQB but for longer ranges it starts to cover up the target therefore for pinpoint accuracy it is less desirable.  I don't think it will matter to me since most of my shooting will be within 100 yards.

I find the Micro's 3.4moa dot great out to about 300m and faster to pick up than the 2moa Aimpoints (YMMV). It's my understanding that the 2moa Aimpoints were designed w/magnifier use in mind.
Tomac

[Riverhouse]

I find the Micro's 3.4moa dot great out to about 300m and faster to pick up than the 2moa Aimpoints (YMMV). It's my understanding that the 2moa Aimpoints were designed w/magnifier use in mind.
Tomac

That's what I have been finding out.  For the CQB, it is a faster acquistion with the larger dots and the 2MOA is great for 100+ yards and that it was more geared towards those shooting further and/or using the 3x magnifiers.  Thanks for your input.

[Mascampo]

I have an EoTech 512 that takes 2AA batteries. It holds zero quite well. I even switched it between two ARs and it still held zero. 

[Mascampo]

I personally don't want to rely on batteries PERIOD. Iron sights for me.

Come on, man! They are not talking about throwing some red paint on iron sights and calling that a RED DOT sight. 

[agunforeachhand]

Come on, man! They are not talking about throwing some red paint on iron sights and calling that a RED DOT sight. 

 

[Joey]

I've been switching back and forth, between the ACOG n Aimpoint.

Can't decide which I like better?
I'm leaning towards the ACOG, until I think about CQB?
In which on a mansized target, the ACOG would still be combat accurate?
And also the price - However research alot, and spend once is what I'm after?

Had the ACOG out a few nights ago, and the low light optics are what had me thinking ACOG?

Just my thoughts - Be Safe

[technique]

I've been switching back and forth, between the ACOG n Aimpoint.

Can't decide which I like better?
I'm leaning towards the ACOG, until I think about CQB?
In which on a mansized target, the ACOG would still be combat accurate?
And also the price - However research alot, and spend once is what I'm after?

Had the ACOG out a few nights ago, and the low light optics are what had me thinking ACOG?

Just my thoughts - Be Safe

Do you have a ACOG model with BAC? If so CQB shouldn't be an issue. Just hold slightly high, you're GTG!

[Joey]

Thats what I was thinkin?

[HD-DVD]

What's the thought on a cheaper RDS like the Bushnell Trophy TRS-25? It's the one Cabelas had on sale for $80 a few months ago and is pretty much an Aimpoint Micro clone. No doubt a $25 Barska or NC-Star likely will disappoint but where do you draw the line and say "good enough".

I'm having good luck with mine so far with 5.56/,223, it holds zero well (cowitnessed to my irons). I have to say it's real light which is a plus. Anyway I guess time will tell and if you want to be sure you get the Aimpoint. I'm gambling to save the money and do have the irons to fall back on.

[Tomac]

What's the thought on a cheaper RDS like the Bushnell Trophy TRS-25? It's the one Cabelas had on sale for $80 a few months ago and is pretty much an Aimpoint Micro clone. No doubt a $25 Barska or NC-Star likely will disappoint but where do you draw the line and say "good enough".

I'm having good luck with mine so far with 5.56/,223, it holds zero well (cowitnessed to my irons). I have to say it's real light which is a plus. Anyway I guess time will tell and if you want to be sure you get the Aimpoint. I'm gambling to save the money and do have the irons to fall back on.

If just for range use, Primary Arms sells a variety of excellent budget optics. If it's for possible "serious social use" then save your pennies for the Aimpoint/Eotech of your choice.
Tomac

[No-One]

There are quite a few options in the 1-4 powered optic market now that may be something to consider as well . Lit reticles that perform kind of like a red dot with a little extra oomph for when things get out past CQB ranges .

[HD-DVD]

I noticed that Cabelas has the Bushnell Trophy TRS-25 on sale again for $80.

[SNAFU]

I have a Vortex Stikefire Red/Green Dot on my ar.

Been a great scope for the price, Only down side is the odd battery size.

http://www.vortexoptics.com/product/vortex-strikefire-red-dot-scope-for-ar15



Includes a screw on 2x Magnification lens

Sportsmans sells them FYI.